I still vividly remember receiving automated calls every Saturday morning in college insisting that I settle a debt under someone else's name. It was a case of mistaken identity, and eventually I sorted it out by tracking down the collection agency and calling them during business hours. This was a tremendous inconvenience, however. I strongly support limitations on robocalls, on total call volumes, and ask that you consider creating a complaint process for harassing or mistargeted calls. Collection agencies should face financial sanctions for misbehavior, payable to the target of their abuse.
Possibility #1 seems like the best way to achieve the FDCPA goals of not harassing or abusing the debtor AND not disclosing the existence of a debt to 3rd parties. Once the collector has verified that they are speaking to the debtor, they can (and should) give the mini-miranda disclosure.
While possibility # 5 (sometimes called a Zortman message) IS a workable solution to the FOTI dilemma and comes the closest to complying with the competing sections of FDCPA, it seems much more embarrassing to a debtor who's roommate/spouse/child etc. hears the message.
I also like the suggestion from #6 that the debtor can "opt out" of the mini-miranda warning in subsequent communications. In the real world, once a collector & debtor have spoken there is not much chance that the debtor does not know the purpose of subsequent communications or that the collector is calling to collect.
Option #2 seems like a good idea, but very few people will actually go to the website AND an eavesdropping 3rd party could go to the website and figure out that the call was regarding a debt.
As most Courts have stated, # 4 (FOTI message) is just rubbish. Furthermore, I would urge the CFPB to disregard almost any case or rationale that has come out of that circuit.
Ultimately, I just want CFPB to set forth SOME/ANY "safe harbor" provisions on these types of issues such that we can stop guessing how to be in compliance.
The idea of "private policing" has done nothing to actually change the way collectors behave. Instead, it has created a cottage industry for former slip-and-fall attorneys who can now extort collection agencies (or attorneys) who simply cannot afford to risk paying out $50,000 in atty fees if their "bona fide error" defense turns out to be insufficient. Essentially, a well-intentioned collector has no choice but to either pay these extortionists or risk bankruptcy.
These proposed rules are the first thing I've seen come out of FDCPA that might actually make a difference in the way that collections are handled. Therefore, I encourage CFPB to actually follow through with providing guidance to collectors instead of spending so much time, web space and effort teaching debtors how to sue collectors.
I have been called by a bill collector and asked for somebody who I had no knowledge of, we'll say "Joe Smith". I say "Joe Smith doesn't live here. In fact, I have never heard of Joe Smith". The caller states: "Well, do you have Joe's current phone number?" I say "I repeat, I don't know a Joe Smith".
The collection agency caller states "I'm sorry I am not allowed to remove this number from our database unless a new number replaces it."
Oh, come on now, seriously?
Debtors should be able to leave a message for a specific debtor, the name of their company and request a call-back at a specified number. When a consumer returns this type of call, the collector or debtor should be required to give them the mini-Miranda warning. There is no need for collectors to leave messages revealing the nature of their calls. The Health Information Privacy and Portability Act prohibits disclosure of protected information to unauthorized parties and the same should apply to debt collectors.
I had one debt collector in particular who called me a liar when I told him I wasn't the person he was looking for. This was after he violated the FDCPA by calling me at 7:00 on a
Saturday morning. I called them back immediately and spoke with a supervisor who said she'd take me off their hit list. I asked her if she got my number out of the phone book. She claimed that they had not. A few months later, they started in on me again. Obviously they still considered me a liar. I sent them a cease-communication letter with a copy to my state's Attorney General, who has been wonderful in all this.
At that point, I started sending out letters every time I received a collection call, and, other than the one, none ever called me again. But, honestly, why should I have to put up with this sort of thing? At one point I was receiving daily calls from one collector or another.
I can name names, and I have a thick file folder full of copies of my letters and responses to my Attorney General.
It has been a wild ride, and I sure hope it's over. I'm approaching the one-year anniversary of my most recent collection call.
I just wish they wouldn't use the phone book as their primary research tool.
Thank you for providing me this forum.
As a bankruptcy lawyer, I frequently deal with clients or are harassed by debt collectors calling family or neighbors. the collectors will claim they are acquiring location information, but this is frequently the case where the consumer has been at the same location for years. I hope the rules will narrow the "location information" exception so that it can only be used where there is really doubt about the consumer's location.
Agreed. And it should be their real phone number. So that when you miss their phone call and try to call them back, it should go to the real company. And not say something like "the call can not be completed as dialed." I mean, what is the point in that. Some debtors can't get to their phone before it goes to the answering machine and if the collectors don't leave a message, the debtor will try to call back. But then the call can't be completed when you try to call back. So, really what was the point of the call. Many debtors would just assume it was a scam call. Increasing Right Party Contacts should be the goal. And that goal can only be reached if the real phone number is showing up on calller id.
I don't like #2 because if they were to start telling consumers to a to a certain website, that opens the door for spammers/hackers to increase virus infections by simply doing the same thing. Just calling every phone number in the phone book and telling the consumer navigate to a certain website and then infect their computer.
With a fully communicative voicemail identifying the purpose of the call I think one call is quite diligent. If they choose to call and leave no message then they might as well have done nothing. At least this way their message is being delivered.
No robo-calls or automated dialing systems should be allowed for any profit-making or solicitation purpose. Period. You can call me if a tornado is coming, but if you want money, you have to use a person. And I don't see why I should pay for the call.
As an identity theft victim, I have had dozens of experiences with debt collectors. I will start with what I consider the worst of the worst. A large portion of my theft was through online payday loan companies. The thief would deposit payday loans of around $1000-$1,500 into bank accounts she had opened online in my name. Collection agencies buy the debts after they have gone unpaid, and I have not had a positive experience with a single agency that is collecting the debt from a payday loan. They do not care what the FDCPA says, and in many cases, don't even know what the FDCPA is! They will call and leave a message. You return the call to the person and that person is never available. He is always "in court". This immediately sends a red flag to me. I know the FDCPA by heart. The fact is, they want to give the consumer the impression that they are suing debtors constantly and will tell you that your case has been referred to "the courthouse" for filing. When prodded, for example, if I ask which courthouse, you can actually hear them typing in the background as they try to google your county court information. Unfortunately, they never get it right. I have been told it was filed in the Dallas, Connecticut court. The identity thief in this instance had used an old address of mine in Texas and the address was somehow merged with my actual Connecticut address. When I prod further, it becomes even more disturbing. They will not give me their actual name. I have actually been told that the person I was speaking to was Bill. Bill Collector. I have been called names that truly brought me to tears. Their is no debt validation with these collectors. I can't even get the actual company name is some cases. They are debts previously owned by Speedy Cash and Check n Go (Check N Go being the absolute worst) or they are hired by Speedy Cash or Check N Go to collect debts on their behalf. The original creditor is no help at all. Submitting a police report and identity theft affidavit does nothing. They do not care about what the laws state they must do when notified by a consumer with proper supporting documents that the consumer is a victim of identity theft. They will ignore it. They ignore everything sent via Certified Mail. They receive it, but they do nothing with it. The consumer is left to complain to the state attorney general or file a lawsuit. How has the theft of my identity become my problem to fix? Law enforcement will not involve themselves in civil disputes regarding debt. All they will do is provide you with a police report. But they will also accuse you of being your own "identity theft." When I filed my report in person, I was taken to a detective who sat with my husband and myself in a small room with nothing but a small table and three chairs. He documented our information and then he attempted to scare us into confessing to attempting to use the police department as a way to escape our financial obligations. His reasoning was that if the account is in my name, has my birthday and SSN linked to it, why in the world would he consider me a victim of identity theft? What proof do I have? That's the million dollar question. How do you prove you didn't open an account online with Speedy Cash or Check N Go? They do not require so much as a bank statement, a photo ID, an employment verification or even proof of residency. They will deposit a payday loan into an account that IS NOT EVEN IN YOUR NAME. I learned through speaking with these banks that some loans deposited into the accounts in my name actually were loans with an entirely different person's name on the EFT transfer. The banks do not have any kind of system in place to reject transactions that do not match the account holder's name. So the bottom line is, I have no actual PROOF. It is very easy to prove that I DID actually apply for and receive these loans. And the easiest route is always the best route when it comes to detectives who are over-worked, short-staffed, and are under pressure by the Chief to get the case out of the office and on to the DA. I finally convinced him to take my complaint and file a report. But it is completely useless to me. I have tried submitting my police report directly to the credit reporting agencies, who are then required by law to block all fraudulent information. However, there is a loophole there, as well. They don't have to accept your report if they have reason to believe that you have made a misleading or false statement. And when I originally disputed these debts as "NOT MINE" instead of "FRAUDULENT", that was proof enough for them to reject my request for blocking. At the time they were reported, I had not been contacted by any creditor or collector, I had not received any notifications in the mail. All I knew is the accounts were "Not Mine". The system is so broken. Punishment for violating the FDCPA is not harsh enough, and it is up to the consumer to go it alone, hire a competent attorney, and go through the entire process for "$1,000 per violation." How do I even prove a violation when I cannot record a call on my end? Is it worth my money? The time it takes is equally unjustifiable. Collection agencies like the ones I have described that collect for payday loans don't care about the law. They don't follow the law, and until the states or US Attorney General fines these payday loan companies or legislation is made that makes it so that payday loan companies cannot report outstanding debt to ANY consumer data provider, they will continue to ruin the lives and credit of identity theft victims. Because they make it so very easy for thieves to commit a crime. In doing so, the only viable solution for punishing these companies and not verifying that the loan information is actually real, by requiring hard documentation or shutting down the online loan altogether, is for them to have the right to collect on these loans taken away. I have learned many valuable lessons and have much more to share regarding other types of accounts, but in this case, I am guilty. I must hire a team of private detectives, computer forensics experts and expert polygraph examiners to prove my innocence. Identity theft victims as a whole will continue to be guilty until proven innocent until we find a better way to manage credit files. The social security number as identifier of your entire credit history needs to be seriously researched. I think you will find that as a means of identifying a person for credit applications and credit reporting, it is archaic. Who knows how many people have access to my SSN? It doesn't even represent who I am. It hasn't for many years.
I am an experienced recipient of collection calls. As I have explained in another post here, I live in a fairly large metro area, and whenever anyone with my very common last name and first initial skips town without paying his/her bills, I'm the one who gets the calls from the debt collectors.
Here are some of my thoughts on these calls, and I have received dozens:
I know that a call about "an important business matter," is a call about a debt. I have received many of these kinds of calls.
Whenever a debt collector calls me and leaves a message without a name, it doesn't take me very long to figure out that the call is from a debt collector. If the debt collector calls and leaves a name, that debt collector is revealing to me, an unrelated third party, that the individual has a debt in collection. I consider this to be a violation of the spirit of the FDCPA if not the letter. Whenever a debt collector calls me, I am burdened with the knowledge that I now know the name of someone else who has a debt in collection.
I've gotten any number of the calls described in #4 telling me not to listen if I'm not the named individual. The big problem with that is that, one again, the name of a debtor is being revealed to me, and then there's the added dilemma of the fact that now my phone number has been programmed into a debt collector's robo dialer. When that happens, the calls continue to come. I always disobey the instructions and listen to the message. I then call the debt collector to report a case of mistaken identity. It's the only way to stop the calls.
In all the collection calls I have gotten over the years, I have received only one message with the "mini-Miranda" warning. When I called the debt collector to report another case of mistaken identity I was connected with an individual in a call center in India. After I told the woman she had the wrong person, I thanked her for the "mini-Miranda" and she hung up on me.
I don't have any answers, just lots of experience. I hope someone finds this information useful.
No matter how you slice this conversation, phone calls are the biggest abuse. You can have rules and do about the time, but they are ignored. Until you or the FTC creates rules that fine these people -- and not put the burden on the consumer to sue -- this abuse will go on. I have to laugh at these querstions. You have to be putting me on. The most abusive things debt collectors do are with their phones. They block their numbers still. They use various numbers they mislead their identities. THE PROBLEM is the onus is on the hapless consumer to get legal redress. Not good enough.You need to create fines and actually impose them. That will stop this phone abuse. They call at work, always wkill have some excuse. Oh, this was the only number we had. and call after hours. Well we are in California. Please. Be honest, this is an outrage what these companies have done, and nobody has minded the store on them. Never should the onus be on the consumer to get this to stop. You have to find a lawyer who thinks a whopping $1,000 is worth suing over. Please. You have rigged this system in favor of the sharks., and that is why these sleazy companies have proliferated and have grown more and more egregious in their actions.
What you need to do is 1) no more recorded calls. 2) call from one number and 3) as soon as someone says stop calling, STOP. if there is any call beyond that, they get fined.
Agreed, people will have to write a letter because none of these companies will admit they were told to stop calling. But they do receive the letters, which should go to a physical address and to a person, not just a vague company name.
Last, stop allowing these bad companies to change their names. They get in trouble, they change their names, and go on doing terrible things under another name.
Just look online at some of these companies and how many names they've gone through.
The reason this got so bad is nobody has been looking out for the consumer.
The current penalty for violating the FDCPA is "not less than $100 and up to $1000." Further, the violations cannot be "stacked" so those violating the law 10 times on one debt, will generally only face the maximum of a $1000 penalty. Punitive damages are hard to prove. A $1000 penalty is not a deterrent to the debt collection industry, and too low to get most attorney's interest is taking these cases. If we want to see the law upheld, raise the penalty to $10,000 per violation - and you'll see most of these characters clean up their act and stop using abusive collection tactics.
It is mind-boggling that this has even been allowed to continue for so long. This should have been addressed years ago! Stop allowing the company to change names to continue poor practices. Stop allowing the companies to use hundreds of phone numbers to try to trick someone. Stop letting them block numbers so caller ID only shows "unknown" or even 000-0000. Stop putting the burden of stopping this entire industry on the consumer (who has no teeth or way to be sure the judgment is being enforced) THAT IS THE JOB OF CONSUMER PROTECTION! It's in your name! You are there to PROTECT the CONSUMER. Force these companies to properly identify themselves when asked! Debt collectors have been calling my cell phone for 5 years trying to collect a debt from someone I have never heard of. This random person put down my phone number as a contact on a loan, defaulted on that loan, and now i am the one being harassed because of a stranger! When called and they identify who they are looking for, i used to say that i did not know the person then try to ask for the name of the company, but they had already hung up on me and would then call again later. So then, after they ask for the person, I immediately ask for the name and address for the company. They would ask again for "name," I would ask again for the name and address for the company. They would ask again for "name," I would ask again for the name and address for the company. It becomes a shouting match, they say "I'll just call back later when you are in a more 'information giving' mood," and hang up on me. There was/is no recourse, protection, or help for people like me. The company won't give me their name and I don't have a phone number (because it is "unknown") to give to the regulating bodies to report harassing behavior. I have no way to stop these people from calling my cell phone! It is my phone! I pay the bill, not them! They should have no "RIGHT" as they put it to call a cell phone!
I was harassed for months by a collector who used robo-calls 5 and 6 times a day and blocked its caller ID, for what turned out to be five different debts, none of which were mine. Robo-calls were not answered; if I picked up, nobody was there, and no messages were ever left. The blocked caller ID was "1 Unavailable," which is designed to outfox call-blocking from the recipient's end, and makes it impossible to identify the caller using reverse number lookups and the like. One day I picked up and finally there was someone on the other end, so I was able to figure out who was calling, although they were very reluctant to say who they were. I then looked them up on the internet and got a phone number for them. I repeatedly stated I was not the person they were looking for, but they refused to stop calling. I finally got an attorney and after months of the attorney bickering with them, I did get a small money settlement. This was occurring when I was getting chemotherapy treatment for cancer and was very ill. My life was hell for months because of these practices. Collectors should be prohibited from concealing either their identity or their call-back numbers. This happened because I had moved and was assigned a new number that evidently had belonged to a number of individuals who had outstanding debts. I was afraid to change my number again because it would just usher in a new batch of collectors. There should also be much, much, much stiffer monetary penalties for violations. The guilty party in the above scenario was a national collection agency with huge annual revenues; the piddly amount I was eventually paid was to them a tiny fraction of one cent compared to their annual revenues. I just happen to be an attorney myself, and ran their name on Pacer--they had been sued over and over in state and federal court and had actually paid million dollar fines to state attorneys general--also just a small cost of doing business for them compared to their enormous annual revenues. We need much, much stiffer penalties. These people are cyber bullies with absolutely no scruples. At the very least they should be required to identify themselves on caller i.d. with a legitimate callback number, and robo-calls should be made illegal.
I left a long comment about one particular collector, but recently was harassed by yet another one who was trying to collect from someone else who was not me. Their caller ID was not a phone number; it was just the names of different states, but turned out to be the same company. These people are bottom-feeders with no scruples. Accurate caller ID should be required so the victim can at least identify the collector and have a call-back number for them. And monetary penalties should be much, much stiffer to discourage their outrageous, predatory and harassing practices. Harrassment is part of their business models. These people are scum and should be required at the very least to identify themselves accurately. Robo-calls and ID spoofing should be illegal with stiff fines.
tjl
1
I still vividly remember receiving automated calls every Saturday morning in college insisting that I settle a debt under someone else's name. It was a case of mistaken identity, and eventually I sorted it out by tracking down the collection agency and calling them during business hours. This was a tremendous inconvenience, however. I strongly support limitations on robocalls, on total call volumes, and ask that you consider creating a complaint process for harassing or mistargeted calls. Collection agencies should face financial sanctions for misbehavior, payable to the target of their abuse.
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Tfleeman
2
Possibility #1 seems like the best way to achieve the FDCPA goals of not harassing or abusing the debtor AND not disclosing the existence of a debt to 3rd parties. Once the collector has verified that they are speaking to the debtor, they can (and should) give the mini-miranda disclosure. While possibility # 5 (sometimes called a Zortman message) IS a workable solution to the FOTI dilemma and comes the closest to complying with the competing sections of FDCPA, it seems much more embarrassing to a debtor who's roommate/spouse/child etc. hears the message. I also like the suggestion from #6 that the debtor can "opt out" of the mini-miranda warning in subsequent communications. In the real world, once a collector & debtor have spoken there is not much chance that the debtor does not know the purpose of subsequent communications or that the collector is calling to collect. Option #2 seems like a good idea, but very few people will actually go to the website AND an eavesdropping 3rd party could go to the website and figure out that the call was regarding a debt. As most Courts have stated, # 4 (FOTI message) is just rubbish. Furthermore, I would urge the CFPB to disregard almost any case or rationale that has come out of that circuit. Ultimately, I just want CFPB to set forth SOME/ANY "safe harbor" provisions on these types of issues such that we can stop guessing how to be in compliance. The idea of "private policing" has done nothing to actually change the way collectors behave. Instead, it has created a cottage industry for former slip-and-fall attorneys who can now extort collection agencies (or attorneys) who simply cannot afford to risk paying out $50,000 in atty fees if their "bona fide error" defense turns out to be insufficient. Essentially, a well-intentioned collector has no choice but to either pay these extortionists or risk bankruptcy. These proposed rules are the first thing I've seen come out of FDCPA that might actually make a difference in the way that collections are handled. Therefore, I encourage CFPB to actually follow through with providing guidance to collectors instead of spending so much time, web space and effort teaching debtors how to sue collectors.
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quino1974
3
Something must be done were criminal charges can be pursued if a collection agency continues to harass through phone calls and emails.
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TaxGuy
4
I have been called by a bill collector and asked for somebody who I had no knowledge of, we'll say "Joe Smith". I say "Joe Smith doesn't live here. In fact, I have never heard of Joe Smith". The caller states: "Well, do you have Joe's current phone number?" I say "I repeat, I don't know a Joe Smith". The collection agency caller states "I'm sorry I am not allowed to remove this number from our database unless a new number replaces it." Oh, come on now, seriously?
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bonzarel
5
Debtors should be able to leave a message for a specific debtor, the name of their company and request a call-back at a specified number. When a consumer returns this type of call, the collector or debtor should be required to give them the mini-Miranda warning. There is no need for collectors to leave messages revealing the nature of their calls. The Health Information Privacy and Portability Act prohibits disclosure of protected information to unauthorized parties and the same should apply to debt collectors.
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cathysceebs
6
I had one debt collector in particular who called me a liar when I told him I wasn't the person he was looking for. This was after he violated the FDCPA by calling me at 7:00 on a Saturday morning. I called them back immediately and spoke with a supervisor who said she'd take me off their hit list. I asked her if she got my number out of the phone book. She claimed that they had not. A few months later, they started in on me again. Obviously they still considered me a liar. I sent them a cease-communication letter with a copy to my state's Attorney General, who has been wonderful in all this. At that point, I started sending out letters every time I received a collection call, and, other than the one, none ever called me again. But, honestly, why should I have to put up with this sort of thing? At one point I was receiving daily calls from one collector or another. I can name names, and I have a thick file folder full of copies of my letters and responses to my Attorney General. It has been a wild ride, and I sure hope it's over. I'm approaching the one-year anniversary of my most recent collection call. I just wish they wouldn't use the phone book as their primary research tool. Thank you for providing me this forum.
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robertrossweed
7As a bankruptcy lawyer, I frequently deal with clients or are harassed by debt collectors calling family or neighbors. the collectors will claim they are acquiring location information, but this is frequently the case where the consumer has been at the same location for years. I hope the rules will narrow the "location information" exception so that it can only be used where there is really doubt about the consumer's location.
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stopwithspoofedcallerID
8
Agreed. And it should be their real phone number. So that when you miss their phone call and try to call them back, it should go to the real company. And not say something like "the call can not be completed as dialed." I mean, what is the point in that. Some debtors can't get to their phone before it goes to the answering machine and if the collectors don't leave a message, the debtor will try to call back. But then the call can't be completed when you try to call back. So, really what was the point of the call. Many debtors would just assume it was a scam call. Increasing Right Party Contacts should be the goal. And that goal can only be reached if the real phone number is showing up on calller id.
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stopwithspoofedcallerID
9
I don't like #2 because if they were to start telling consumers to a to a certain website, that opens the door for spammers/hackers to increase virus infections by simply doing the same thing. Just calling every phone number in the phone book and telling the consumer navigate to a certain website and then infect their computer.
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brendandavis
10
With a fully communicative voicemail identifying the purpose of the call I think one call is quite diligent. If they choose to call and leave no message then they might as well have done nothing. At least this way their message is being delivered.
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Bonita Kale
11
No robo-calls or automated dialing systems should be allowed for any profit-making or solicitation purpose. Period. You can call me if a tornado is coming, but if you want money, you have to use a person. And I don't see why I should pay for the call.
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erinintexas
12
As an identity theft victim, I have had dozens of experiences with debt collectors. I will start with what I consider the worst of the worst. A large portion of my theft was through online payday loan companies. The thief would deposit payday loans of around $1000-$1,500 into bank accounts she had opened online in my name. Collection agencies buy the debts after they have gone unpaid, and I have not had a positive experience with a single agency that is collecting the debt from a payday loan. They do not care what the FDCPA says, and in many cases, don't even know what the FDCPA is! They will call and leave a message. You return the call to the person and that person is never available. He is always "in court". This immediately sends a red flag to me. I know the FDCPA by heart. The fact is, they want to give the consumer the impression that they are suing debtors constantly and will tell you that your case has been referred to "the courthouse" for filing. When prodded, for example, if I ask which courthouse, you can actually hear them typing in the background as they try to google your county court information. Unfortunately, they never get it right. I have been told it was filed in the Dallas, Connecticut court. The identity thief in this instance had used an old address of mine in Texas and the address was somehow merged with my actual Connecticut address. When I prod further, it becomes even more disturbing. They will not give me their actual name. I have actually been told that the person I was speaking to was Bill. Bill Collector. I have been called names that truly brought me to tears. Their is no debt validation with these collectors. I can't even get the actual company name is some cases. They are debts previously owned by Speedy Cash and Check n Go (Check N Go being the absolute worst) or they are hired by Speedy Cash or Check N Go to collect debts on their behalf. The original creditor is no help at all. Submitting a police report and identity theft affidavit does nothing. They do not care about what the laws state they must do when notified by a consumer with proper supporting documents that the consumer is a victim of identity theft. They will ignore it. They ignore everything sent via Certified Mail. They receive it, but they do nothing with it. The consumer is left to complain to the state attorney general or file a lawsuit. How has the theft of my identity become my problem to fix? Law enforcement will not involve themselves in civil disputes regarding debt. All they will do is provide you with a police report. But they will also accuse you of being your own "identity theft." When I filed my report in person, I was taken to a detective who sat with my husband and myself in a small room with nothing but a small table and three chairs. He documented our information and then he attempted to scare us into confessing to attempting to use the police department as a way to escape our financial obligations. His reasoning was that if the account is in my name, has my birthday and SSN linked to it, why in the world would he consider me a victim of identity theft? What proof do I have? That's the million dollar question. How do you prove you didn't open an account online with Speedy Cash or Check N Go? They do not require so much as a bank statement, a photo ID, an employment verification or even proof of residency. They will deposit a payday loan into an account that IS NOT EVEN IN YOUR NAME. I learned through speaking with these banks that some loans deposited into the accounts in my name actually were loans with an entirely different person's name on the EFT transfer. The banks do not have any kind of system in place to reject transactions that do not match the account holder's name. So the bottom line is, I have no actual PROOF. It is very easy to prove that I DID actually apply for and receive these loans. And the easiest route is always the best route when it comes to detectives who are over-worked, short-staffed, and are under pressure by the Chief to get the case out of the office and on to the DA. I finally convinced him to take my complaint and file a report. But it is completely useless to me. I have tried submitting my police report directly to the credit reporting agencies, who are then required by law to block all fraudulent information. However, there is a loophole there, as well. They don't have to accept your report if they have reason to believe that you have made a misleading or false statement. And when I originally disputed these debts as "NOT MINE" instead of "FRAUDULENT", that was proof enough for them to reject my request for blocking. At the time they were reported, I had not been contacted by any creditor or collector, I had not received any notifications in the mail. All I knew is the accounts were "Not Mine". The system is so broken. Punishment for violating the FDCPA is not harsh enough, and it is up to the consumer to go it alone, hire a competent attorney, and go through the entire process for "$1,000 per violation." How do I even prove a violation when I cannot record a call on my end? Is it worth my money? The time it takes is equally unjustifiable. Collection agencies like the ones I have described that collect for payday loans don't care about the law. They don't follow the law, and until the states or US Attorney General fines these payday loan companies or legislation is made that makes it so that payday loan companies cannot report outstanding debt to ANY consumer data provider, they will continue to ruin the lives and credit of identity theft victims. Because they make it so very easy for thieves to commit a crime. In doing so, the only viable solution for punishing these companies and not verifying that the loan information is actually real, by requiring hard documentation or shutting down the online loan altogether, is for them to have the right to collect on these loans taken away. I have learned many valuable lessons and have much more to share regarding other types of accounts, but in this case, I am guilty. I must hire a team of private detectives, computer forensics experts and expert polygraph examiners to prove my innocence. Identity theft victims as a whole will continue to be guilty until proven innocent until we find a better way to manage credit files. The social security number as identifier of your entire credit history needs to be seriously researched. I think you will find that as a means of identifying a person for credit applications and credit reporting, it is archaic. Who knows how many people have access to my SSN? It doesn't even represent who I am. It hasn't for many years.
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cathysceebs
13I am an experienced recipient of collection calls. As I have explained in another post here, I live in a fairly large metro area, and whenever anyone with my very common last name and first initial skips town without paying his/her bills, I'm the one who gets the calls from the debt collectors. Here are some of my thoughts on these calls, and I have received dozens: I know that a call about "an important business matter," is a call about a debt. I have received many of these kinds of calls. Whenever a debt collector calls me and leaves a message without a name, it doesn't take me very long to figure out that the call is from a debt collector. If the debt collector calls and leaves a name, that debt collector is revealing to me, an unrelated third party, that the individual has a debt in collection. I consider this to be a violation of the spirit of the FDCPA if not the letter. Whenever a debt collector calls me, I am burdened with the knowledge that I now know the name of someone else who has a debt in collection. I've gotten any number of the calls described in #4 telling me not to listen if I'm not the named individual. The big problem with that is that, one again, the name of a debtor is being revealed to me, and then there's the added dilemma of the fact that now my phone number has been programmed into a debt collector's robo dialer. When that happens, the calls continue to come. I always disobey the instructions and listen to the message. I then call the debt collector to report a case of mistaken identity. It's the only way to stop the calls. In all the collection calls I have gotten over the years, I have received only one message with the "mini-Miranda" warning. When I called the debt collector to report another case of mistaken identity I was connected with an individual in a call center in India. After I told the woman she had the wrong person, I thanked her for the "mini-Miranda" and she hung up on me. I don't have any answers, just lots of experience. I hope someone finds this information useful.
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gmt512
14
No matter how you slice this conversation, phone calls are the biggest abuse. You can have rules and do about the time, but they are ignored. Until you or the FTC creates rules that fine these people -- and not put the burden on the consumer to sue -- this abuse will go on. I have to laugh at these querstions. You have to be putting me on. The most abusive things debt collectors do are with their phones. They block their numbers still. They use various numbers they mislead their identities. THE PROBLEM is the onus is on the hapless consumer to get legal redress. Not good enough.You need to create fines and actually impose them. That will stop this phone abuse. They call at work, always wkill have some excuse. Oh, this was the only number we had. and call after hours. Well we are in California. Please. Be honest, this is an outrage what these companies have done, and nobody has minded the store on them. Never should the onus be on the consumer to get this to stop. You have to find a lawyer who thinks a whopping $1,000 is worth suing over. Please. You have rigged this system in favor of the sharks., and that is why these sleazy companies have proliferated and have grown more and more egregious in their actions. What you need to do is 1) no more recorded calls. 2) call from one number and 3) as soon as someone says stop calling, STOP. if there is any call beyond that, they get fined. Agreed, people will have to write a letter because none of these companies will admit they were told to stop calling. But they do receive the letters, which should go to a physical address and to a person, not just a vague company name. Last, stop allowing these bad companies to change their names. They get in trouble, they change their names, and go on doing terrible things under another name. Just look online at some of these companies and how many names they've gone through. The reason this got so bad is nobody has been looking out for the consumer.
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Determined1
15
The current penalty for violating the FDCPA is "not less than $100 and up to $1000." Further, the violations cannot be "stacked" so those violating the law 10 times on one debt, will generally only face the maximum of a $1000 penalty. Punitive damages are hard to prove. A $1000 penalty is not a deterrent to the debt collection industry, and too low to get most attorney's interest is taking these cases. If we want to see the law upheld, raise the penalty to $10,000 per violation - and you'll see most of these characters clean up their act and stop using abusive collection tactics.
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DianeMathers
16
It is mind-boggling that this has even been allowed to continue for so long. This should have been addressed years ago! Stop allowing the company to change names to continue poor practices. Stop allowing the companies to use hundreds of phone numbers to try to trick someone. Stop letting them block numbers so caller ID only shows "unknown" or even 000-0000. Stop putting the burden of stopping this entire industry on the consumer (who has no teeth or way to be sure the judgment is being enforced) THAT IS THE JOB OF CONSUMER PROTECTION! It's in your name! You are there to PROTECT the CONSUMER. Force these companies to properly identify themselves when asked! Debt collectors have been calling my cell phone for 5 years trying to collect a debt from someone I have never heard of. This random person put down my phone number as a contact on a loan, defaulted on that loan, and now i am the one being harassed because of a stranger! When called and they identify who they are looking for, i used to say that i did not know the person then try to ask for the name of the company, but they had already hung up on me and would then call again later. So then, after they ask for the person, I immediately ask for the name and address for the company. They would ask again for "name," I would ask again for the name and address for the company. They would ask again for "name," I would ask again for the name and address for the company. It becomes a shouting match, they say "I'll just call back later when you are in a more 'information giving' mood," and hang up on me. There was/is no recourse, protection, or help for people like me. The company won't give me their name and I don't have a phone number (because it is "unknown") to give to the regulating bodies to report harassing behavior. I have no way to stop these people from calling my cell phone! It is my phone! I pay the bill, not them! They should have no "RIGHT" as they put it to call a cell phone!
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Lori
17
I was harassed for months by a collector who used robo-calls 5 and 6 times a day and blocked its caller ID, for what turned out to be five different debts, none of which were mine. Robo-calls were not answered; if I picked up, nobody was there, and no messages were ever left. The blocked caller ID was "1 Unavailable," which is designed to outfox call-blocking from the recipient's end, and makes it impossible to identify the caller using reverse number lookups and the like. One day I picked up and finally there was someone on the other end, so I was able to figure out who was calling, although they were very reluctant to say who they were. I then looked them up on the internet and got a phone number for them. I repeatedly stated I was not the person they were looking for, but they refused to stop calling. I finally got an attorney and after months of the attorney bickering with them, I did get a small money settlement. This was occurring when I was getting chemotherapy treatment for cancer and was very ill. My life was hell for months because of these practices. Collectors should be prohibited from concealing either their identity or their call-back numbers. This happened because I had moved and was assigned a new number that evidently had belonged to a number of individuals who had outstanding debts. I was afraid to change my number again because it would just usher in a new batch of collectors. There should also be much, much, much stiffer monetary penalties for violations. The guilty party in the above scenario was a national collection agency with huge annual revenues; the piddly amount I was eventually paid was to them a tiny fraction of one cent compared to their annual revenues. I just happen to be an attorney myself, and ran their name on Pacer--they had been sued over and over in state and federal court and had actually paid million dollar fines to state attorneys general--also just a small cost of doing business for them compared to their enormous annual revenues. We need much, much stiffer penalties. These people are cyber bullies with absolutely no scruples. At the very least they should be required to identify themselves on caller i.d. with a legitimate callback number, and robo-calls should be made illegal.
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Lori
18
I left a long comment about one particular collector, but recently was harassed by yet another one who was trying to collect from someone else who was not me. Their caller ID was not a phone number; it was just the names of different states, but turned out to be the same company. These people are bottom-feeders with no scruples. Accurate caller ID should be required so the victim can at least identify the collector and have a call-back number for them. And monetary penalties should be much, much stiffer to discourage their outrageous, predatory and harassing practices. Harrassment is part of their business models. These people are scum and should be required at the very least to identify themselves accurately. Robo-calls and ID spoofing should be illegal with stiff fines.
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